ai-yi-yi....another one

[ProblemAgain]

you think maybe it's the water? or maybe it is genetic? but here is a complete fu**wit and from texas...what a surprise!....

Incoming Texas State Rep. Kyle Kacal says guns don’t kill people—ping-pong kills people.

"I've heard of people being killed playing ping-pong—ping-pongs are more dangerous than guns," he says. "Flat-screen TVs are injuring more kids today than anything."

The Consumer Product Safety Commission does warn that some sports equipment may have unexpected hazards—for instance, brands of tennis rackets have been recalled because of possible exposure to lead.

Also in the category of Things That Are Dangerous But Are Not Ping-pong: One model helicopter had to come off the shelves because of—yikes—“laceration hazards.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/texas-lawmaker-ping-pongs-deadli...

[ProblemAgain]

gee that was in a church too,...so was this..and so was the sikh temple shooting...do we need armed guards at all our churches too?

State police say man fatally shoots ex-wife during church service in north-central Pa. church

Published December 03, 2012

Associated Press

COUDERSPORT, Pa. –  An elementary school music teacher has been jailed on charges that he walked into a north-central Pennsylvania church service and shot and killed his ex-wife.

The defense attorney for 52-year-old Gregory Eldred, of Coudersport, did not immediately return a call for comment Monday.

Eldred is charged with first-degree murder for Sunday's shooting of 53-year-old Darlene Sitler, also of Coudersport.

Troopers from the Coudersport barracks did not immediately offer a description or explanation of the shooting at the First United Presbyterian Church where, the Bradford Era (http://bit.ly/YH01tE ) reports, Sitler served as organist and choir director.

Police say Eldred shot Sitler Sunday about 11:20 a.m. during a church service, but that nobody else was injured.

Others in the congregation grabbed Eldred and held him until police arrived.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/03/state-police-say-man-fatally-s...

or do we NOT have a gun problem in our country?

[ProblemAgain]

and the call for armed volunteers to guard our schools led one person to describe it as assembling a force of george zimmermans 

[ellevan]

Armed volunteers is a truly horrible suggestion, made even more disturbing by the image of a force of George Zimmermans.

[frenchy]

so you brought it up . what do you know about george zimmerman and what do you know about treyvon martin ?? 

[ProblemAgain]

this is not gonna be about george zimmerman. the point being made by the person saying that was all the legal turmoil that the inclusion of armed volunteers at a school would be. and by the way...the idea that armed guards would deal with all this as a fait accomplii is incorrect..one person said "one shot...one problem solved..if they had had armed people at columbine....." well guess what?? they did...and shots were exchanged between armed sheriff's deputies and the two shooters before they got into the building..

[frenchy]

touche doug , because anyone who brought up george zimmerman in this school shootin obviously knows nothin about george zimmerman or treyvon martin .. my first thought when the nra said they should put armed guards in every school was gee what would that cost ?? with the whole country fixin to go over the fiscal cliff and communities cryin the blues because their coffers are empty on account of the fallin real estate values they can't make their budgets .. the very idea of puttin an armed guard or two in every school would add millions to each counties budget .. plus the prerequisite would have to be someone who could not only shoot a gun but be a crack shot .. cause after all if you're in the thick of a firefight you can't take out 9 kids with friendly fire tryin to shoot one bad guy .. and the idea of a retired cop might sound good but you'd have to have the stamina and agility to hang in there and be able to duck and dodge in a hurry .. which is one of the reasons most cops are retired .. cause they can't bob and weave and duck and dodge with all that much agility once they're past 55 .. so the ideal candidates would be 25 to 40 or so .. and they would have to work closely with the local police force yet be apart .. so if you start doin the math everyones taxes would go up by a few hundred dollars at least .. so the next question is how bad would we want it ?? but if we did do it i can predict that school shootins would go way down . way way down .. probably the next place we'd have to put armed guards would be your local library .. cause that would be the next no guns allowed place that they could inflict the most damage .. and this conversation would start all over again .. or .. they could try to recognize the early warnin signs of some of these nutcases when they're in school and try to do what they can to head them off at the pass so to speak .. problem is we won't get em all no matter what we do .. we might get half of em tho and that would still be a huge step in the right direction .. no easy answers here .. but these guns don't walk into these schools by themselves .. 

[ProblemAgain]

so the idea is institute more controls on assault weapons...and make it harder for people to get their hands on them...i wish there was a 20 quiz that would weed out the nutcases...but there isn't....and here are some things to think about...

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/urban-advocates-gun-control-talk...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/fareed-zakaria-the-solution-...

http://news.yahoo.com/fact-checking-nra-press-conference-185542748....

http://www.stonekettle.com/2012/12/bang-bang-crazy-part-three.html?...

[ProblemAgain]

and another..

http://www.khou.com/news/local/The-cost-of-the-guards-in-schools-de...

[frenchy]

well i read the links and they offer gun control as their answer .. which of course would take away my 4th ammendment rights .. and i'll gladly give them up if you gladly give up your right to free speech .. so it would be a trade off .. all the citizens who want the 4 ammendment repealed and vote for it will lose their right to free speech .. all those who vote against it can keep their right to free speech .. think that would fly ?? of course not .. but once you lose the right to your arms free speech comes next .. maybe not right away .. but its loomin on the horizon .. 

and i saw the last link about armin the teachers or volunteers in schools .. and i'm on the fence about that .. why ?? because as i said earlier anyone who does that job would have to be a crack shot ..and have the agility to not only get out of harms way in a firefight but do it in such a way they can return fire and take out the bad guy and not a few kids in the process.. a tall order .. one of the reasons the columbine officers weren't effective could be just that ..i don't know what their skill levels or agility levels were .. thats a big part to leave out .. any rent a cop can get a gun permit .. for the kind of attacks these yo yo's do you need them zero dark 30 kinda marines who know their shit ..    and they should be able to prove it and be tested at least yearly to retain their in school gun permit .. and of course they would have to undergo a physch evaluation .. every year .. and if anyone on the staff thinks they are actin a little hinky then they must be ready to undergo more evaluations to explain any errant behavior.. which actually should be somethin that anyone who gets a gun should have to do .. you want to cut back on the crazies who have guns ?? lets start with psysc evaluations for everyone applyin for a gun permit .. have them get at least 5 references who will say this guy ain't crazy .. and if it turns out that he is you call all 5 of them and ask why they said he was fine when he wasn't .. and if someone gets their hands on their parents guns then why are the parents not to blame ?? especially if they know their kids are actin a bit crazy ?? maybe not to blame for murder per sey but at least as an unwitting accomplice ?? that might get parents to be a bit more careful with where and how they store their guns ..again i'll repeat what i said before .. there are literally millions of gun owners here in the usa who are no threat to anyone except maybe another person who wants to harm them .. and then there are the gang members who shoot each other daily .. you think their guns are actually registered ?? and if you pass a ban they'll turn them in ?? i'd be willin to bet that half of the gun homicides are by them kinda people .. in chicago its back to like it was when al capone was there .. there are shootouts on a daily basis .. why not enforce some of the gun laws already in place there ?? this is still the tip of the iceberg . i'm sure there are plenty of things they can still do that i ain't even thought of yet .. but as i said when this thread started out .. this is a dangerous world .. and an imperfect one at that .. we all want to blame someone .. well for one it wasn't the schools fault altho i'm sure in hindsight someone will try to blame them .. and the guns didn't walk in there by themselves and just start shootin them little kids .. i say it was the nutjob who pulled the trigger .. could anyone have done anything to prevent this ?? maybe , maybe not .. i dunno .. i think we could try harder to see the signs cause there's a lot ridin on it and we're startin to see the results of keepin quiet when there's a problem child among us .. i think we need physcologists who are trained in every school district to recognize the signs .. and maybe we could turn a bad boy good if we reach them in time .. maybe not .. but at least we know he's a problem and we keep track of him instead of lettin them disapear into the woodwork .. and last but not least if one or two still slip thru don't think its not workin cause nothin works all the time .. ted williams was considered the best hitter of all time with a battin average just over 400% .. so that meant that he didn't get a hit about 596% of the time ..and he's in the hall of fame .. and i think hittin a baseball is a lot easier to figure out than somebodies mental state .. 

[ProblemAgain]

i don't see how banning assault rifles and extended magazines would interfere with your rights regarding unreasonable search and seizure frenchy..now if you meant the second amendment, the right to keep and bear arms, to nullify that  steps would have to be taken to outlaw all firearms ...that is NOT what the issue is and never has been. in fact that is a rather smelly red herring dragged across the trail to try to confuse the issues...and they do enforce gun laws in chicago and atlanta and houston and all other locations. i think your point was tho how do you get those guns off the streets..that is a much harder problem because all it takes is a person to go to a gun show and with absolutely no background check, they can buy virtually any kind of weapon that is not illegal, put it in the trunk of a car and go sell it to the bad guys...in a sting investigation, it was found that 63 per cent of the sellers at gun shows went ahead and still sold the guns to someone who said they couldn't pass a background check...and in some cases they sold to people with absolutely NO identification....in some places in texas, deputies and sheriffs were selling off guns seized and supposedly destroyed. others were buying weapons for their departments and selling them out the back door...so simple....pass a ban on assault rifles (and this won't take the ones out of circulation that already exist cause the laws don't work that way)...and the nra was also against banning tefloncoated 'copkiller' bullets that go right through body armor and fragment inside the body for maximum killing power...the very kind of round you DON"T use for hunting unless you like spitting out pieces of metal from your venison...

face the facts, you can't keep everyone protected but you can make it a hell of a lot more difficult for the homicidal loonies to get their hands on the most efficient method of killing people...we don't have mental tests that predict when or if a person is going to go off...remember after many of these incidents, there are comments like "oh he was always a real quiet person. i never would ever have thought he'd do something like that..." and the silly point about pingpong and baseball bats and knives and rocks..you understand it is silly right? 58 people don't stand around waiting for a guy with a knife to get to their turn...or line up and wait for their turn for a loon practicing headbashing with a baseball bat...that is what is termed 'obfuscation'...it is a sidestep to obscure the real issue

[frenchy]

yeah that was my bad on the 2nd ammendment .. i always thought it was the 2nd ammendment but when i did a search for the exact wording it came up as the 4th .. all i did was paste it in there .. afterwards i realized its not the 4th its the 2nd .. but the ammendment is the same .. and i agree with a lot of what you're sayin .. we need to try to keep the guns away from as many bad guys as we can .. the gun show loophole should be closed .. i'm in agreement with you on that .. but when you compare the amount of people killed because they didn't have any gun rights compared to how many have been killed here cause we do the numbers aren't even close .. i can't repeat this enough times .. the second ammendment was not written for hunters .. not ever .. huntin is not part of the issue here .. not even a little bit .. i think that mental evaluations would be the best place to begin .. i mean after all has any of these mass shootins been by anyone you'd call sane ?? even remotely ?? i think early detection of these sick individuals is where we should start .. because they are sick .. and not only does it effect them anymore .. now it effects all of us .. so what is it worth to have some kinda mental health system that works a whole lot better than what we have now ?? some place that lanza's mom could have brought her kid before all this shit jumped off ?? anyone have any idea ??  

[ProblemAgain]

frenchy what you are talking about essentially is a mental fitness exam for EVERYONE...cause yes there are indicators for people like the sandy hook shooter but there are also cases like the guy who gets fired and comes back with a gun to clean up his workplace..or any of the huge numbers of people we read about every day who inflict damage on their families or coworkers or the schools oir the churches or the irs offices and on and on...so who do you administer these too and what test? there really isn't a brief simple test that can be used as an indicator of future cases of going postal