so what is art?

[bubbadave]

hi,
'what is art?' i suppose this question has been around sense people have been painting on cave walls. there are so many endevers that are now considered 'art' that i am really not sure just what it may be myself.

several years an artist crapped into a jar, peed onto it and called it art. to me, a former plumber, it was not, it was what i did for many years. chase turds. the government agreed with me when they tried to cut their controbutions to the arts. i suppose the government and me agreed on something.

what do you think? was these turd floating jars really art? actually, my understanding was the jars sold for $1200 each. go figure.

respectfully
dave

[Ubercounselor]

I think it is anything perceived or intended to be art. That is what is so cool about it. My daughter was at camp and looked up at the top of this giant, tent-like gazebo they were sitting under and noticed that the center where all wire structures that were supporting the roof came together was creating a very cool, geometrical effect and she took a pic of it close up. That was art to her--something not intended to be art, but perceived to be. Shit in a jar? I am with you man, I would call that "sewage" but unless the "artist" was just being a smartass, if he really thinks that is arty, then guess what? Yeah, that piece of shit under glass is art by gawd!!!

[Grace Linda]

Boy Dave, When I went to Art school I had a rude awakening. There were big debates over this subject a whole department went around the school causing havoc. They were called conceptual artist.

The piece you describe above, smells like that. Meant to invoke a response from the viewer. I mostly think it is about negative attention. When I would mention this back in the day, I was just considered conventional and un-hip. My taste in art is a bit more expansive since I went to school, but there are just some thing I consider CRAP

[WS]

Hey, UC, Well I want to agree and disagree - I think it was art when she took the picture of it and showed it to you - in my mind art requires two parties - a producer and a "reader". (Could also be the architect and her). In my mind something meaningful has to be communicated either aesthetic or otherwise (could simply be this is a beautiful rhythm/pattern). I think a work that causes revulsion and makes one think is as much art as something that communicates sublime beauty. I think there are many elements (not all of which must be present in a particular piece, pattern, rhythm, tone etc.) but minimally one must have two parties and some kind of communication (even if the communication is that art is meaningless).

Ubercounselor said:

I think it is anything perceived or intended to be art. That is what is so cool about it. My daughter was at camp and looked up at the top of this giant, tent-like gazebo they were sitting under and noticed that the center where all wire structures that were supporting the roof came together was creating a very cool, geometrical effect and she took a pic of it close up. That was art to her--something not intended to be art, but perceived to be. Shit in a jar? I am with you man, I would call that "sewage" but unless the "artist" was just being a smartass, if he really thinks that is arty, then guess what? Yeah, that piece of shit under glass is art by gawd!!!

[Ubercounselor]

Yeah, good point ya got there regarding music and food. I like that someone broadened it to include those things. I mean, really, I think my damned dog is art. I really do.

Brine said:

I think art can be music as well. It may be more than an image or a structure. A meal at Gary Danko? Art. Your favorite song that always makes you cry? Art. Mapplethorpe? Art. Thomas Kinkade? Not art to me, but is art to many. The Ramones? Art to me, but not art to many.

Sheldon Christenson said:

Art is . . . . my favorite uncle.
Really. Art is the expression of an idea through image or structure. Architects are normally artists first. I draw cartoons and landscapes. People look at my cartoons and see a message that is clearly thought out, and yet obviously done in manner that entertains. My best ideas come after doing "serious" art first. A thought comes to mind, a what if, and the comic comes out of the serious.
Art draws feelings and thoughts out of the one experiencing it. An artist may be able to strongly influence those thoughts and feeling, but also has no real control. Art is made and interpreted. Art may be the experience of influencing and being influenced by the thoughts and feelings of others.

Perhaps it is easier to say what is not art. If it doesn't draw in the one experiencing it, no communication happens between the artist and the viewer. Heh, what do I know.

[Robyn]

Bubbadave, are you referring to Manzoni? From Wiki:

"Artist's shit" (Italian: "Merda d'artista") is a work of art by the Italian artist Piero Manzoni. The work is a tin can in an edition of 90 labeled in Italian, English, French and German with the description '"Artist's Shit", contents 30gr net freshly preserved, produced and tinned in May 1961.' They were intended to be sold for their weight in gold, the price fluctuating according to the market.

At the time this piece was created, Manzoni was involved in creating works that explored the relationship between art production and human production. Another example of this would be the piece "Artist's Breath" ("Fiato d'artista") a series of baloons filled with Manzoni's breath.

On May 23, 2007, a tin was sold for EUR124,000 at Sotheby's[1], and in October 2008, tin 083 was offered for sale at Sotheby's with an estimate of GBP50-70,000.[2]. The increasing value of this work of art adds to its level of irony. It is not known whether the can actually holds the contents advertised on its label.

Also from Wiki under Piero Manzoni:

His work is widely seen as a critique of the mass production and consumerism that was changing Italian society (the 'Economic Miracle') after WW2 [4].

and

Artist's Shit

In May 1961 Manzoni created 90 small cans, sealed with the text Artist's Shit (Merda d'Artista). Each 30-gram can was priced by weight based on the current value of gold (around $1.12 a gram in 1960).[12] The contents of the cans remain a much-disputed enigma, since opening them would destroy the value of the artwork. Various theories about the contents have been proposed, including speculation that it is plaster.[13] In the following years, the cans have spread to various art collections all over the world and netted large prices, far outstripping inflation. The most recent can to be auctioned, #19, sold on 26 February 2007 in the USA for $80,000.[14]. It was described as:

"It is a joke, a parody of the art market, and a critique of consumerism and the waste it generates."
—Stephen Bury [15]


Hope this helps.

[Maricel Evasco]

Art is a subject dear to me. What is art.... for me, art is an eloquent re-creation of personal experience or knowledge imbued with meaning.
"...Without an act of recreation the object is not perceived as a work of art." ~ Dewey